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Raising a question about programming ethics

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ArcticMoon

#1 ·

First I wanted to post this in games, but then I realised it has nothing to do with exact games or anything, so it ended up here.
I'm raising a very interesting question about programming ethics, and I'm really curious to see how you folks view all of this.
There's a guy who creates various mods for different games using AI, and he talks about it openly. That's not the problem, don't worry, it's just something you need to know. Other people can also create these same mods this way, of course, if they have a subscription. The guy has Patreon, and it has three different tiers. Supporter, Requester, and something in between, but I don't remember the name. The most important one here is the Requester. It costs a ton, but you can ask the guy to create a mod for any game. These games sit in a queue until the guy finishes his other projects.
There's a very popular game. The game is in the requests category. He created a modding environment, created an input handler, and that's basically it; even the tutorial doesn't work completely. Another person is also interested in the game, well, that's why it was requested by others, of course. But the mod isn't being developed; the game has been sitting in the requests category for about two months now. Today, the interested person downloads all the dll files and the input handler, fixes all the bugs in the mod, implements new features, fixes the whole tutorial, and adds full keyboard and gamepad support.
And then tells the guy the whole story:
"Hi [Name], sorry for bothering, but I decided to help you out with insert game name here. I fixed this, this, and this too, and I plan to keep going because everything works perfectly." Of course, in a more detailed and polite manner, but the game shouldn't be revealed for now. And the guy writes back:
"I'm not against it, but as you can see, the game is in my requests and I plan to work on it as soon as my other projects are done. So, will I be able to use your fixes in my project later? I'm not forcing you to stop working, but I came up with the project."
And this is exactly the question. If the guy didn't know that someone was already working on this mod, would his reaction have been the same? And does he seriously think that others who worked on this using their own subscription will let him make money off it, especially if he wasn't the one who did the main part?
What do you think, is this ethical, especially in the world of AI?
Let's debate, but stay civilized, please.

"As I watch this generation try to rewrite history, one thing I'm sure of is that it will be misspelled and have no punctuation."

thedominator

#2 ·

I honestly don't know. I think it is ethical if both parties receive the message and get it, and they give permission and they collaborate, but I think it's unethical for the owner of this Patreon to just take the other guy's work and say, "Yes, I did it all myself."

Ferrumite666

#3 ·

2 likes
See, I assume there's this language both people involved speak called English, and they can use it to discuss the situation, and they can come to an agreement about whether the fixer gives the original creator the stuff, or whether the fixer gets the rights, or whether the creator pays the fixer for his work, or whether they settle this with a duel or something, if they agree to any of those options it would result in a much better situation than whatever stupid ethical principals get applied. Ethics is just the broadest form of political correctness, and political correctness is fascism pretending to be manners.

Sir-Charlie

#4 ·

God I hate to say it, but I agree with post 3. I don't think any ethical principles are violated here. The guy reached out and asked if it was OK, but the guy who actually took it on himself now has the option to refuse. It only becomes an issue if the original modder takes the guy's work, claims it as his own and profits off of it.
All that I survey, I could easily destroy. From time to time, it is important to remind these small creatures of the true extent of my power.

marchoffmann

#5 ·

Honestly the fact that he even wants money for using AI is ridiculous. The new modder just did a whole shitload of work and i think he should at least be credited if nothing else.

djsenter

#6 ·

3 likes
Well, AI costs too :)
Senter San

Sir-Charlie

#7 ·

5 likes
You also have to put effort into vibe coding. You can't just say mod the game for m and be done with it.
It's like saying that someone who codes inPython shouldn't be paid because they didn't use assembly.
All that I survey, I could easily destroy. From time to time, it is important to remind these small creatures of the true extent of my power.

balteam

#8 ·

3 likes
In the past, maybe you get more often money for hours of working, now it's not important. I don't check if you create the app 1 week or 1 year, If it's interesting for me, I will pay.
Zapraszam osoby posiadające piesy, lub chcące je posiadać, do dołączenia do grupy o psach przewodnikach.

djsenter

#9 ·

2 likes
Yes, because AI is a tool, but if we value the idea and potentially final good execution, since you need to give a good prompt and fix a lot of errors the AI will inevitably make, that takes time and other resources. Speaking of time, there are limits on codex, there's only as much you can do in a given time limit. Btw interesting how this topic appeared here, because we're talking about the AI quite actively on the Polish community as well :D
Senter San

christmas_child2013

#10 ·

Honestly I whish Code X had higher limits. I ran out of messages last week :(

alchappers

#11 ·

I agree with others with the fact that if someone makes a really good program and they used AI to help in the making of said program, at the end of the day so what if AI was used in the development, if the program is good and the developer has put a lot of time and effort into it, that cancels out anything regarding the tools used.

patricus

#12 ·

this is just horrible